« 16 »
  • Reply
Subterfrugal
Sep 8, 2011


WaterIsPoison posted:

The only true way to evaluate a terrorist attack is not by the body count, but by the reaction of the victim state after the attack.

Boston and her people have acted incredibly well in this regard.

-People running toward danger to help others.
-Reports of runners continuing to run to donate blood.
-Insanely fast response by EMS and National Guard personnel.
-Professional response by law enforcement, with exceptional responsiveness to the media given the circumstances.

To the extent that a city can instantly respond to an attack, Boston's done a pretty great job of saying "Fuck you, terror."

Zuhzuhzombie!!
Apr 17, 2008


Breitbart.com "shaming" CNN for claiming "if it's a H2O2 it's AQ, if it's more sophisticated it's Right Wing" and pitching a fit over mentioning "right wing". Headline just above that one? "AUTHORITIES DETAIN SAUDI NATIONAL AS SUSPECT".

Zikan
Feb 29, 2004


Intruder posted:

Is there actually a suspect in custody or was that also NYP "reporting"?

It's right wing "reporting"

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.c...ve-been-made-in

Chokes McGee
Aug 6, 2008


silvergoose posted:

Frankly, exactly as reputable.

And owned by the same company IIRC, so it's not a huge surprise they're shoveling their bullshit there, too.

TehSaurus
Jun 12, 2006


Volkerball posted:

You'd be a lot more terrified if you were there.

This is the attitude that I have a hard time understanding. You're way more likely to die of a car accident or being killed by someone you know than you are to die in a terrorist attack, at least at current and historical rates. May as well be terrified of your neighbor or your car. Maybe you're right and it would be different if I had been there.

G. Quietly
Oct 22, 2010


Volkerball posted:

Iraqi elections are going on at the moment too, aren't they?

They're scheduled for the 20th and the leadup's been pretty ugly. Something like twenty separate car bomb attacks in three cities today alone.

OAquinas
Jan 26, 2008


Per the Boston Globe, 2 dead, over 64 injured. If the hospital count is accurate injured could top 100, with multiple dismemberment injuries.


Homemade claymores?

Joementum
May 23, 2004


BPD now saying that the JFK library "explosion" is related to an earlier electrical fire, not likely related to marathon event.

zoux
Apr 28, 2006


Zuhzuhzombie!! posted:

Breitbart.com "shaming" CNN for claiming "if it's a H2O2 it's AQ, if it's more sophisticated it's Right Wing" and pitching a fit over mentioning "right wing". Headline just above that one? "AUTHORITIES DETAIN SAUDI NATIONAL AS SUSPECT".

If it's hydrogen peroxide?

Intruder
Mar 4, 2003


djw175 posted:

Apparently Fox News reported the same thing NY Post reported.

I'm sure Fox News is eager to parrot anyone who claims it was a Muslim attack

OneEightHundred
Feb 28, 2008


DiabloStarCraft posted:

Hope it's not something like the beginning of an IRAesque style terrorist campaign, with lots of small attacks all over the place.
I think it's always been the case that distributed attacks would be much more lethal, easier to pull off, and require much less equipment than a single big attack, but terrorist groups will opt for a big attack (or a flashier, equally-lethal attack) anyway because it gets noticed. The only other real reason to use a bomb is with the expectation of getting away with it.

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006


greatn posted:

According to MSNBC ticker just now there have been two dismantled, but you can't rely on a frenzied media too much.

quote:

5.02pm ET

Davis, the Boston police commissioner, contradicts an earlier AP report and says that no additional devices have been found at the race scene. But he says that controlled explosions have been, and may continue to be, carried out on bags and packages that fleeing spectators may have left.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/201...-explosion-live

So it sounds like the "additional devices" found were the result of preemptive response and breathless reporting.

cafel
Mar 29, 2010


How are u posted:

I feel like a bit of a jerk for feeling this way but this doesn't seem to be a particularly effective act of terrorism. I mean two dead and twenty three injured is terrible but its also a pretty low number. The perpetrator could have done way more if he'd used an automatic weapon, so I'm guessing that its amateur domestic terrorism executed by somebody who barely had any idea of what they were doing but also isn't committed enough to go down shooting.

I guess I'm just desensitized because I do not feel terrified at all.

Honestly seeing the police presence in the videos of the explosion I don't think an automatic weapon would have been as effective. A shooter would have been dropped before they could hit a few dozen people even in the denser crowd. And in the case of a shooter you have the certainty of a body and a face even if you don't know their background and motivation. Right now everyone is spending a lot more time worrying about who did this and why.

I'm not terrified, just sickened. Sandy Hook continues to feel so recent to me and now there are pictures out of people with their legs blown off coming from what's supposed to be a joyous and uplifting event. And it's such a big event that there are going to be people across the whole planet worrying about their loved ones. I had a friend in Boston who was volunteering at the race, I just was lucky enough to get in touch with them and find out that they were alright early on. I'm guess I'm tired of having to hear about any sort of body count even if they don't get that high.

Zuhzuhzombie!!
Apr 17, 2008


zoux posted:

If it's hydrogen peroxide?

AQ uses H2O2 in their detonators.

Mister Adequate
Oct 29, 2011


Subterfrugal posted:

Boston and her people have acted incredibly well in this regard.

-People running toward danger to help others.
-Reports of runners continuing to run to donate blood.
-Insanely fast response by EMS and National Guard personnel.
-Professional response by law enforcement, with exceptional responsiveness to the media given the circumstances.

To the extent that a city can instantly respond to an attack, Boston's done a pretty great job of saying "Fuck you, terror."

Yeah even on the videos of the explosion going off you can see people kicking into gear within a couple seconds of realizing what happened, and they re-oriented all the stuff to support the Marathon in no goddamn time flat. From my armchair perspective it looks like a damned commendable response.

WaterIsPoison
Nov 5, 2009


Subterfrugal posted:

To the extent that a city can instantly respond to an attack, Boston's done a pretty great job of saying "Fuck you, terror."
I'm not quite sure. All those things you mentioned are immediate triage and response level decisions. The real evaluation will be the U.S. foreign policy response and the overall American cultural response. I'd like to think that Americans have grown up a bit since 2001, so I'm hopeful nothing too drastic will occur.

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006


OAquinas posted:

Per the Boston Globe, 2 dead, over 64 injured. If the hospital count is accurate injured could top 100, with multiple dismemberment injuries.

Homemade claymores?

Metal trash cans turn into shrapnel when you place explosive devices inside them. Same principle as surrounding the explosive with ball bearings in a hand grenade. Someone mentioned that they are putting bombproof plastic cans in DC nowadays.

MaxxBot
Oct 5, 2003


Wales Grey
Jun 19, 2012


Intruder posted:

I'm sure Fox News is eager to parrot anyone who claims it was a Muslim attack

Fox News and the NY Post are both owned by Rupert Murdoch's News Corp.

zoux
Apr 28, 2006



Thanks for advocating genocide.

Sick_Boy
Jun 3, 2007


zoux posted:

Thanks for advocating genocide.

Surely he must be joking, right?

Red_Mage
Jul 23, 2007


zoux posted:

This NYP stuff really pisses me off. Are there any countries that we would consider to have reasonable freedom of press that also have restrictions on just making shit up? If so, what do those statutes look like?

Canada does. It looks surprisingly reasonable, if you knowingly publish false news, and there is harm, the CRTC (Canadian FCC) can come down on you in a variety of ways.

MaxxBot
Oct 5, 2003


Sick_Boy posted:

Surely he must be joking, right?

He writes for WND, if that clarifies that at all for you.

OAquinas
Jan 26, 2008


Paul MaudDib posted:

Metal trash cans turn into shrapnel when you place explosive devices inside them. Same principle as surrounding the explosive with ball bearings in a hand grenade. Someone mentioned that they are putting bombproof plastic cans in DC nowadays.

Didn't consider the can to be another source of shrapnel. If they were relying on that instead of it being a coincidence (of stashing the bomb in it) that's really well thought out.

Very interested to see who/what is behind this. We're not out of lone nut territory, but its a lucid lone nut if so.

TVarmy
Sep 11, 2011


https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/323911328832036864

Now NBC is saying there is a suspect in the hospital. Since this seems to be alternating between confirmed and unconfirmed, I'm still not convinced.

Sick_Boy
Jun 3, 2007


MaxxBot posted:

He writes for WND, if that clarifies that at all for you.

Even so... that can't be right, can it? Jesus.

Troy Queef
Jan 11, 2013


More things coming in: the Boston-Ottawa hockey game scheduled for tonight has been postponed, and Logan Airport has grounded all outgoing flights. No word yet on if they'll divert incoming flights to other airports.

zoux
Apr 28, 2006


Sick_Boy posted:

Surely he must be joking, right?

Was Juan Williams joking when he said he literally racially profiled people who looked Muslim on airplanes? As a white person I hate to chide African Americans about anything, but seriously, do they not get that the rhetoric used against Muslims today is identical to the rhetoric used against blacks and especially those active in civil rights and equality pre 1965?

OAquinas
Jan 26, 2008


Sick_Boy posted:

Even so... that can't be right, can it? Jesus.

WND will literally print anything, and is the outlet of choice for fringe wingnuts.

Pretty sure they've had columnists seriously advocate nuking mecca.

A DENVER FAX
Jan 19, 2012


OAquinas posted:

WND will literally print anything, and is the outlet of choice for fringe wingnuts.

Pretty sure they've had columnists seriously advocate nuking mecca.

WND still has birthers

Ernie Muppari
Aug 3, 2012


TehSaurus posted:

This is the attitude that I have a hard time understanding. You're way more likely to die of a car accident or being killed by someone you know than you are to die in a terrorist attack, at least at current and historical rates. May as well be terrified of your neighbor or your car. Maybe you're right and it would be different if I had been there.

Uh...yeah, you'd also be more likely to be afraid of dieing in a car crash or being killed by a neighbor if you'd recently survived a crash or a neighbor had attempted to kill you. That's just kinda' how that works.

A DENVER FAX
Jan 19, 2012


TVarmy posted:

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/323911328832036864

Now NBC is saying there is a suspect in the hospital. Since this seems to be alternating between confirmed and unconfirmed, I'm still not convinced.

Police just officially stated there are no suspects in custody

Volkerball
Oct 15, 2009


So the JFK library just happened to catch the fuck on fire today? Was it a really small fire or something? I did see no one was hurt.

Subterfrugal
Sep 8, 2011


WaterIsPoison posted:

I'm not quite sure. All those things you mentioned are immediate triage and response level decisions. The real evaluation will be the U.S. foreign policy response and the overall American cultural response. I'd like to think that Americans have grown up a bit since 2001, so I'm hopeful nothing too drastic will occur.

Absolutely true. Regardless of the motive/source of the attack, though, the shear scale of 9/11 is going to make follow-up attacks look pretty pale in comparison.

I'm reminded of the Amish school shooting. The communities' immediate response was to publicly forgive the shooter, reach out to his family, and tear down the schoolhouse entirely. If the purpose of the attack is to terrorize, I can't imagine a better response than publicly demonstrating that they've failed. The combined efforts of federal authorities, state authorities and private business could secure the scene, collect evidence, clean everything up, and repair the damage overnight. I'm not suggesting they should do this because it ignores the individual sacrifices and pain of the injured and dead. But I can't imagine a bigger macro-level "fuck you" to whomever launched the attack then to have business as usual the next day.

Beer4TheBeerGod
Aug 23, 2004


Volkerball posted:

So the JFK library just happened to catch the fuck on fire today? Was it a really small fire or something? I did see no one was hurt.

Electrical fire, and the JFK Library twitter says it's not related.

Joementum
May 23, 2004


Obama to speak at 6:10PM. Next local press conference at 7PM.

Joementum fucked around with this message at Apr 15, 2013 around 13:45

zoux
Apr 28, 2006


Subterfrugal posted:

I'm reminded of the Amish school shooting. The communities' immediate response was to publicly forgive the shooter, reach out to his family, and tear down the schoolhouse entirely. If the purpose of the attack is to terrorize, I can't imagine a better response than publicly demonstrating that they've failed. The combined efforts of federal authorities, state authorities and private business could secure the scene, collect evidence, clean everything up, and repair the damage overnight. I'm not suggesting they should do this because it ignores the individual sacrifices and pain of the injured and dead. But I can't imagine a bigger macro-level "fuck you" to whomever launched the attack then to have business as usual the next day.

Unfortunately, terrorism is so effective against Americans because we are easy to scare, cannot comprehend risk in any meaningful way, and go completely bonkers after every terrorist event. If this was done by an Islamic terrorist (which I have no evidence or inkling of) you can bet the US will go mad with bloodlust and demand we invade some country, and the right and left-hawks will whip these people into a frenzy.

evilweasel
Aug 23, 2002


A DENVER FAX posted:

Police just officially stated there are no suspects in custody

While I expect this report is false there's enough daylight between custody and suspect being watched by police in the hospital who will be arrested if he leaves for that to not be a complete denial.

Highspeeddub
Apr 29, 2005


Chris Matthews interviewing talking head 'experts' on explosions. Did not catch the guy's name but he said on TV, "We can't be sure, it's too soon to tell ... but in my personal opinion based on what I've seen I would say international terrorists. But it's too soon to say we don't have all the evidence yet ... "

evilweasel
Aug 23, 2002


zoux posted:

Unfortunately, terrorism is so effective against Americans because we are easy to scare, cannot comprehend risk in any meaningful way, and go completely bonkers after every terrorist event. If this was done by an Islamic terrorist (which I have no evidence or inkling of) you can bet the US will go mad with bloodlust and demand we invade some country, and the right and left-hawks will whip these people into a frenzy.

This is pseudoscientific garbage.

  • Reply
« 16 »